Monday, June 19, 2006

Preliminary comments on Bruce the heretic

Quite some time ago, I wrote a comment on my friend's blog, in reply to one liberal heretic who calls himself Bruce or 666 888. After some time, he wrote back to me by commenting on my blog on a totally unrelated post (which was on the Global Day of Prayer). I would like to make some preliminary comments before I engage this man's heretical ideas.

I would like to first share what my friend wrote in resonse to this man's accusation in the last post.

As for the quote:" There is a Chinese saying: "Man who cannot smile should not open shop". This is something you friend should learn, because he is not going to win any hearts with that terrible scowl on his face."

My answer to bruce is this: I don't intend to win hearts without Christ and bible centred truth. Just as a Chinese man uses the false image of a smile to attract people to buy things which people do not actually need or want or may even harm them, we cannot preach the gospel in the way (the so called win hearts) that would make them fall away in the future when they discover the real truth.

Anyway, I can't win hearts without Christ. if He uses a scowling man, then so be it. If he uses a smiling man, so be it. Whatever the case, Christ is preached and we rejoice.

To this., I would add a hearty amen. Anyway, knowing him personally, I can testify that Wenxian does not have a scowl on his face. But I disgress.

The other thing which I would like to address before coming to the main issue is the part about the word 'heresy'. Seems that Bruce is one of those academic liberals who exalt themselves in their own so-called wisdom. I use the word heresy as it is defined in the Bible. Who cares how it was defined in ancient times? Does anyone see a connection between how Bruce tries to redefine the word 'heresy' with how Dan Brown does it in the Da Vinci Code? Makes one wonder who borrow this concept from who here.

Finally, to the subject matter itself, I would NOT refute Bruce point by point first. After looking through his blogs and materials, it can be seen that he denies Sola Scriptura or Scripture alone. Thus, if Sola Scriptura is ture, Bruce's arguments are totally demolished, since he elevates Man's wisdom above that of Scripture. In fact, Bruce derogatorily call true Christians "Bible bangers". Well, Bruce, if you are wrong (and I will prove that you are), then a worse fate awaits you; and that is burning eternally in hell and the lake of fire. (Rev. 20:15).

With this introduction, I would first start off in subsequent posts by proving Sola Scriptura first (the necessity, sufficiency, authority and perspicuity of Scripture), then I would demolish Bruce's ridiculous arguments as found in this blog of his.

12 comments:

Bruce said...

Dear Daniel the heretic,
As I said before I am happy to debate you on the subject. But you start your defence with a lot of personal attacks which have nothing to do with the subject. I certainly will not stoop to that on my blog.

Yes we are all heretics in relation to other's beliefs. And you must be in regard to the Roman Catholics. You know this problem was there at the very beginning when the Church split into East and West.

Daniel, you are very good writer- I'll admit that. But you like to chain your rational mind, because by criticising the Scriptures you think you're criticising God. Of course you cannot abide that! That is understandable. But the written word and the Living God are two separate things. You have entwined them to the point of idolatry.

> Makes one wonder who borrow this >concept from who here.

Maybe we looked up "heresy" in the dictionary.

> Bruce's arguments are totally >demolished, since he elevates Man's >wisdom above that of Scripture.

I elevate the Spiritual, the Heavenly, Father God, our Christ above earthly things- books etc.

You gravitate the spiritual into a book.

> In fact, Bruce derogatorily call >true Christians "Bible bangers".

Same way you call people that you disagree with you "heretics".


>Well, Bruce, if you are wrong (and I >will prove that you are), then a >worse fate awaits you; and that is >burning eternally in hell and the >lake of fire. (Rev. 20:15).

You are very confident. Time will certainly tell on this one. I am confidnet in My Lord, Christ, and will dwell there.

"Be perfect, be of good comfort, be of one mind, live in peace; and the God of love and peace shall be with you.
Greet one another with an holy kiss.
All the saints salute you.
The Grace of the Lord Jesus Christ, and the love of God, and communion of the Holy Ghost be with you all. Amen."

XXX,
Bruce
BTW I know your bigotry does not stem from you personally, but from your membership in your favoured sect.

Matthew said...

Dude.
Thanks for that...that's what's been on the tip of my tongue for awhile.
Winning hearts for Christ is important...but we have to make sure that we are doing it using Scripture and truths...not lies.
Thank you for clearing up alot of Bruce's lies.
-Champ out

ddd said...

Hello Bruce,

well.. we will see in the later posts. I think you have proven to us beyond doubt that you place your wisdom above the written Word of God, about which you think is not the living Word of God. This is a denial of Sola Scriptura. And oh, on the subject of personal attacks, I am truly wondering why you are complaining about me making them, especially when your last comment didn't seem very polite either (i.e. 'bigotry' and calling me a heretic). I suggest you should stop that since you are doing the exact same thing as I am doing.

Daniel Chew.

Bruce said...

Hi Daniel,
I'm happy not to call you a heretic, but I have made the point that members of one earthly church might call members of other churches "heretics".

You are my brother in Christ, whether you like it or not, whether you are disagreeable or not. Humanity as a whole is a whole.

As far as being a bigot- you might try and defend yourself against that charge, but my reading of your thoughts suggests that you are a bigot.

": a person obstinately or intolerantly devoted to his or her own opinions and prejudices"

Since you arrogantly believe that others don't have a right to their views, you are a bigot.

I have repeatably said that folk should do their own thinking in coming to the "peaceful round" as regards their world view.

I don't really care whether people believe in reincarnation or not. Reality is as it is.

"Truth passes into a man and is received, regardless of personality. Whether recognised or not, truth finds its way in. The doorkeeper (the personality) to the heart, may be blind to Truth's shadow, as he slips his way past into the soul. Or he might acknowledge him as friend and bid him entrance."

Cheerio,
Bruce

ddd said...

I think we can add the charge of relativism to the growing list of heresies Bruce subscribe to. I think that I should be thankful that Bruce does not apply his postemodern relativism consistently in his life, otherwise 1+1=2 and 1+1=3, and both are right in Bruce's eyes (and if you insist otherwise, you are a bigot). Interestingly enough, while Bruce is willing to let anyone's opinion to be correct, I do not have a right to my view, therefore Bruce is being intolerant of my position here, and thus he is 'intolerably devoted to his own opinions and prejudice against true Christians'. (So who's being a bigot here?)

And oh, Bruce, you are NOT my brother in Christ. You are of your father the devil and do his work (Jn. 8:43-47) by propogating false doctrines and denying Christ.

Just for the record, I should remind you of what you have said in your last post:

'I have repeatably said that folk should do their own thinking in coming to the "peaceful round" as regards their world view.
I don't really care whether people believe in reincarnation or not. Reality is as it is.'

If you think that people should do their own thinking, then why are you trying to convince others of the rightness of your viewpoint? Why are you not shutting down all your blogs and websites which you use to sprout your philosophies? Also, if you don't care whether people believe in reincarnation, then why are you opposing those of us who say it is heresy? Doesn't the mere fact that you oppose us means that you care?

Irrationality abounds...

wenxian said...

I agree with daniel.

Bruce is NOT a brother in the Lord.

We are not what as bruce said: "You are my brother in Christ, whether you like it or not, whether you are disagreeable or not. Humanity as a whole is a whole. "

Daniel and I as well as the rest of the true believers are NOT brothers by blood or by being human beings/ humanity.

We are brothers because we believe in the same truth and worship the same LORD - we all have been set apart from the world.

Just as daniel and i have stated clearly, we do not want to be called 'brothers' with bruce of which daniel has said clearly enough - and i, add a hearty amen:

[Bruce is]"of your father the devil and do his work (Jn. 8:43-47) by propogating false doctrines and denying Christ."

Since bruce enspouses that people should do their own thinking, then he would contradict himself by trying to attack us. Hence, I and Daniel have the complete right to call bruce who we, and the Bible, say Bruce is - a child of the devil.

Bruce said...

Hi Br. Daniel,
You are a funny old fellow! Yes I don't care what you think. Do your own thinking.

I have not sought to attack you personally, ad hominem, I have not called you a devil and sent you to hell and eternal damnation. That is your weird little game.

I deal with the world of concepts where there is a battle going on.

You have a 100% right to your view. See I am not the bigot here.
"Caste the hate out of your heart", is message here again. That is what you will be judged on, not your views on the afterlife. That is what will confine you to hell, not your theological mumbo jumbo.

Anyway all the arguments pro-reincarnation are on my blog.

I think a more important subject is Biblical errancy. And you have shown me the need to start a blog on this.

That Sola Scriptura is, provably, a crock.
'Those who are always saying: ‘That is not in the Bible, that is not true Christianity and those who maintain that it is, are heretics’, must be reminded that Christ also said: ‘I have yet many things to say unto you, but ye cannot bear them now’. He did not say this in order to indicate that He wished to withhold anything from men, but that from epoch to epoch He would bring them new revelations. And this He will do through those who are willing to understand Him. Those who deny that there can be new revelations do not understand the Bible, neither do they understand Christianity. For they have no ears for what is implied in the admonition given by Christ: ‘I have still much to say to you — but prepare yourselves in order that you may be able to bear it and understand it.’
Best Wishes to all,
Bruce ;0)

wenxian said...

Bruce,

It is very rude to call someone a brother when a person has explictly stated that he not be called so with you.

This is the blog of daniel and you have to respect his wishes in the future, of which is the highest priority, in this blog, after God.

We do not show you this same priveillage - no matter how ferevently you claim because you have rejected the basis of it - to be in the same truth under the same God. U have shown clearly that you do not believe what we believe.

Its like barging into a golf club, saying that you are a member when you refuse to pay the fees for membership nor accept the terms of it - even though the terms are very simple and is meant to allow all who are willing to humble themselves to come in.

For the record, you have stated clearly that you think what we are doing is a game: "That is your weird little game." You certainly mock God's laws and statues in the Bible. It is not a game that we have conveived with our own intelligence, but the Bible and the LORD, from wherence and whom all our authority and foundation is built, is the basis of life - not a game to us, but clearly, a game to you. You mock what the Bible says that you are. Then watch how you will be dealt with in the future. It has been clearly told to you.

In the same light, for the golf course analogy, it reflects how you approach christianity - not at the terms of what is written clearly and without excuse in the Bible, but at YOUR own terms - and you shall reap the wages of such a behavoir in the future.

Calling you a devil does not mean "ad hominem" - especially when you have proven us time and time again that such a person is what you truly are.

To use "ad hominem" is to do so without proof. But your proof is too clear for all, as Daniel, joshua and I have shown clearly enough. ref (Jn. 8:43-47)

It is clear both to me and daniel and the readers of the blog that your defence (to me, a though of which i have absolute right of, and you cannot disagree because you don't care what i think and enspouse liberal views selectively) is absolutely pathethic. I agree with Daniel that you are aboundingly irrational here.

tweakmax said...

I wont call Bruce a heretic.

He is not a Christian in the first place, only a new ager.

Writes loads of rubbish.

ddd said...

Well,

since Bruce calls himself a Christian, he is a heretic. I mean, we do call Arians and Pelagian heretics, and the Gnostics also, so I don't think that the term heretic is only for people with less errant views. As long as a person calls him/herself a Christian, and espouses something other than orthodox Christianity, he/she is a heretic.

ddd said...

And oh, Bruce,

I will discuss your "proof-text" that you try to use to refute Sola Scriptura in later posts. You do not need to repost them here.

wenxian said...

Dear tweakmax,

I have seen you fighting fervently for the LORD in bruce's blog itself!

Just would like to encourage and say that your courage to take him on at his own blog and state the truth in his face is very brave of you.

Continue to stand firm in the LORD and in the truth, and i, same as you and my brother daniel here, believe in the idea of Sola Scriptura. (as stated in your comments to bruce's stuff in his websites).

You are my brother in christ and you are welcome to visit my blog and hope to see you around in the future.

I suggest and say that both you and daniel are correct. It is true when Daniel says he is a heretic as he claims to be christian but does not accept its ideas.

You, tweakmax, are also correct when you have identified his real nature, that is present at the same time as he (bruce) being a heretic: a new ager.

God Bless,
Wenxian